Also, no-one should pay attention to the Famitsu score. The day anyone bases a purchasing decision on a Famitsu score is the day they lose any remaining shred of dignity they may have had.

At the end of the day, I think that what all this boils down to is not that installs make or break your gaming experience. Nor that load times are improved with such installs or whether or not this is a sign of good/bad development.

The way I see it, the reaction of some people is just more dismay that we’re increasingly falling further and further from the PS3 that we were all promised in 2005 that pumped out 1080p through it’s two HDMI ports and could give us games twice as good as anything else thanks to the power of its 7800GTX level graphics, Cell processor and Blu-Ray technology.

This is the console that we got so hyped about because of all the ‘rabbits’ that flew out of its hat at the slightest feather touch of its power button, and now, day after day, it just gets more and more normal.

No actually, not normal. More and more like an alternative console that excels in some areas and FAILS in others.

So Blu-Ray was supposed to be the ultimate gaming format… So much space, no developer in the world could squeeze a decent PS3 games’ worth onto a piddley little DVD. More hype that we fell for!

Now it turns out that the 2x speed (or whatever it is) of the BD-Drive in the PS3 is causing such serious load time issues, that 4GB installs are becoming mandatory!

The PS3’s Blu-Ray drive has become a stumbling block!

I don’t for one minute think that these sort of installs were part of the original plan either, since the initial 60GB PS3’s were supposed to hold masses of movies, audio, pics, demos etc on top of being a games machine. Now we can only get 40GB versions in Europe, and I’m sure that Sony are hoping that we all buy more than 10 games over the PS3’s supposed 10 year life-span…

Where’s the next-gen machine gone!?!?

Where’s the new box that was going to make us all throw our PC’s away because it did everything better??

What Sony needs is a AAA killer app that runs at 1080p, streams everything off the disc and has an amazing online mode.

Now that would be more like what we’ve all been waiting for since 2005.

hmm, better crack on with more toast. this thread is turning into a veritable march riot (probably due to the free toast).

The problem I see with this approach on the PS3 is that there is a notable difference between my PC and the Playstation 3 - my PC has 500GB of HDD space and the Playstation 3 (in the only form you can actually buy it in Europe) has 40GB.

A 4GB install is a drop in the ocean on a PC, but it’s 10% of total capacity on your console (probably more, in fact) for just one game. GTAIV mandates an install and I’m sure other titles have and will in the future, so that meagre 40GB of space is going to run out pretty quickly.

Yes, yes, you can upgrade the PS3 HDD yourself, but about 90% of people buying the console are never going to do that, even if they’re actually aware they can.

If 4GB installs are going to become more common as games get bigger (remember, Sony promised us they’d easily fill a BD in the “next” gen) then storage space is going to become more of an issue. I shouldn’t have to “uninstall” console games to make way for new ones.

morriss: I was a developer, but I got out of that nightmare before the PS3 was released so I couldn’t really comment on it. =)

Two reviews so far were Italian OPS3 mag (9/10) and Famitsu (34/40) - which is a good score for an FPS from them.

Mandatory installs. I’m not so bothered about them if the install provides something significant over a non-install on the *PS3*. I don’t think all of these mandatory installs do add enough to warrant it.

On a technical level it’s not so much the data transfer rate of Blu-ray which is the problem, as this is somewhat comparable to the DVD drive in the 360 - it’s the seek time which is a problem.

Personally I though MS showed the way with a HD as standard in the XBox and then took a significant step backwards by not including one as standard on the 360.

RE: the whole resolution thing. That is a bit of a sensitive subject for morriss and has been for some time. I fully understand his opinion there.

Hopefully you can see that my concerns are as a gamer, not someone who is just championing one system over another.

I too have followed Haze for quite some time and have become ‘friends’ - as much as one can call someone whom you’ve never met on the internet a friend - with the Creative Lead on the project.

For me, this discussion was never about whether Haze will be any good or not. Read the demo impressions on the site - we were impressed! The discussion (as far as I could tell) was about whether installs actually elevated a gaming experience on the PS3 over and above what could be found elsewhere. That doesn’t mean that PS3 games aren’t as ‘good’ or ‘there aren’t any games out/coming out for it’.

As a fan of Free Radical’s past games I’ve been following Haze for quite a long time and my comments about its reception are based on many many comments over the course of its publicity - not just ones made in any single topic.

I very much enjoy reading VG247 - both articles and comments - and sharing in the community because I rarely see the sort of trolling or shallow feedback that blights other, higher profile games news sites.

That’s made VG247 my first stop for all videogames news above all other sites. I don’t want to sour the experience I enjoy so much for anyone else here.

Keep up the good work.

“It’s a shame this topic has turned into another short-sighted PS3 bashing argument.”

Or this?

“The reception to Haze has ALWAYS been a shining example of vocal gamer politics and a case of not seeing the wood for the trees.”

My initial comment about not implementing 1080i support is a valid one. Actually I don’t really blame Free Radical either. I blame Sony. Why should the PS3 be the only, and by that I mean it’s unique, HD system ‘on the market’ that doesn’t include an on-board scaler? Why should I and thousands of others have to play games in 576p?

Anyway, that’s an argument for another time. It’s just the reason I brought it up. I’m not going to spend over £50 (in Denmark) on something that cannot be played to its maximum potential.

Hopefully I’ll be able to wangle a review copy instead.

Also: I’m not really trying to score points with the readership either, tbh. So whether they can read through something or not doesn’t interest me at all quite frankly.

And please don’t attempt to play the victim - I think the readership here is smart enough to read through stuff like that. Also, why on earth should people try to make me feel bad because I’m a game developer? Is it because I might have some understanding why some things happen (such as HD installs) instead of asserting a fictitious claim?

“No-one in here has said that Haze is a worse game because of the install.”

Well, uh, you kind of implied by agreeing and also took a swipe at screen resolutions in the very first comment on this post. Scroll up.

If you level a valid criticism or doubt, you’re just a fanboy it seems.

I’ve tried to explain myself and rationally and as intelligently as I can. However, it seems like I’m just short-sighted and wouldn’t know good development and great gameplay if it hit me in the face.

Thanks.

You just carry on being childish if you like. No-one in here has said that Haze is a worse game because of the install. You’re using that as some kind of strawman in order to ‘win’ an argument. Go right ahead, I’m not going to discuss something with someone who just resorts to insults when things aren’t going his way.

I don’t know enough Japanese or Italian to know if any points were deducted for install times.

@Psychotext - that’s ok. Speak to certain people and they’ll tell you running out of hard disk space won’t matter as the PS3 has no games worth playing anyway.

See how it works?